Here is a post for us to discuss rules away from our event post.
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ADCRA RULES for 2008.....
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 Docracer3 |
ADCRA RULES for 2008..... |
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Posts: 1037 (11/18/07 09:15 PM) |
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SS39 |
Re: ADCRA RULES for 2008..... | ||
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Posts: 901 (11/18/07 10:39 PM) |
I'd like to see TUSA 2007 rules, and get a clearer description of "old classic" for tire rule exception and/or small wing! Possibly use the Dwarf car rules back in 1998 when the seat back was 63 inches instead of the current 68 inches of newer classics. Maybe "ball joint" front suspension, and "inside chassis" rear suspension. Basically.... true old classic rules for the tire exception!
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Docracer3 |
Re: ADCRA RULES for 2008..... | ||
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Posts: 1037 (11/18/07 10:57 PM) |
Steve,
I want you to understand that what I said was NOT an attempt to outlaw you from a race. We should be running TUSA rules pure and simple right from TUSA with no exceptions. All this making concessions for a certain type of car is going to lead to a BIG mess. If you or anyone chooses to run a Classic in a field of 95% Modlites that was your choice and you should run on the same tires as they do. TUSA does not make an exception so why should we. WE passed the rule with the knowledge (and within the context) of what #6 and #10 had as motors (1000 cc on gas) We did do the rule as a trial. I think it will lead to us straying away from the TUSA even more. If we keep the rule, I will not be the only one doing anything and everything it allows to take advantage of all of special exceptions. Then, guess what...everyone will do the same thing...and then we are not TUSA Modlite or TUSA Classics anymore. This is headed down the wrong path. |
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Docracer3 |
TUSA | ||
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Posts: 1037 (11/18/07 10:58 PM) |
Look at www.t-usa.org and the 2007 rules are there.
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DCdriver |
Re: TUSA | ||
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Posts: 336 (11/19/07 12:28 AM) |
I'm not in your organization but Doc were you around when the "mod-lites" showed up in a 95% class of Dwarfs {classics}? The people with DWARFS thought the same thing about "mod-lites". IF you want to keep the old cars out there, your going to have to give them a reason to come out and be "field fillers".Exclude Brats from this as they are mod-lites in Dwarf skin.I doubt that this will lead to anything out of hand unless one's mod-lite is always beaten by an old DWARF car.Then i would find me a new motor for my mod-lite.
I hope you guys will keep your rules the way they are as i would like to see this rule spread so the older cars can still run without them ending up as yard art!. good luck guys Jim Mills DCRA est 1988 |
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Docracer3 |
DC Driver.... | ||
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Posts: 1037 (11/19/07 02:40 AM) |
I don't think you understand what is about to happen...this is not going to be an old classics coming out of the woodwork deal. We have not seen that many of those anyway to tell you the truth so it has not added much to our field. More modlites have been added to our field. There is ONLY two classics in our organization. We are almost at one body type and on the same page. Now we have a situation where we have a whole new division and car that is going to start multiplying. It has opened the door for newly constructed classics (or even new modlites converted to a classic by body only) with all the new technology and with all the breaks. That is a problem that I think will manifest itself very soon. And if someone puts a built motor, a roof wing and the "any tire" rule combo together with a car as per above, the ADCRA has defeated the purpose of equalizing the field and getting to a set of rules where everyone is on the same page. It will become a mess.
Thanks for your input, DC. Move to Arkansas. |
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Twister Chassis |
Re: DC Driver.... | ||
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Posts: 220 (11/19/07 04:23 PM) |
I am not involved in you guys club. But what I see happens in one part of the country gos round into the other parts. We have too many classes any given night there six to seven classes at the racetrack. We need to have a class that you can run all over the country. Changing a tire or torque bar is not a big thing he if you traveled to race. But having cars with alcohol against cars without is a big safety factor because most of the dwarf car drivers do not have double layer suits most tracks it is mandatory if you're running alcohol by allowing alcohol on the track in the dwarfs or mods it takes the cost of the safety equipment to high for the class that a it is. . I agree that the rules should be kept simple and uniform. for if a car wants to run it should meet those rules. Grandfathered car should have a time. To be rebuilt to meet the rules that's like a week.. Stan at twister chassis a Texas dwarf car
Twister chassis
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Jeff5903 |
No new class of car because of the tire rule | ||
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Posts: 281 (11/19/07 09:07 PM) |
The tire rule was a motion that I made after talking with several people in the club about trying to get some of the older classic that are sitting around the state collecting dust back on the track.
The rule simply reads "Older classic's open tire rule" Older classic's as in 63 inch seat back, nonadjustable A arms, ball joints, stock spindles, older motors. There has been discussion this year about adjusting that rule to keep anyone from taking a mod-lite and turning it into a classic. But to make these changes they need to be voted on and that is where we are at. I think that Bill and Steve Sweer have done an outstanding job on the 39 car. But the rule needs to be tightened up to keep mods from being converted to classic's just to run the open tire. No new class of car will be started anywhere. Jeff Newkirk 501-837-1745 |
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SS39 |
Re: No new class of car because of the tire rule | ||
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Posts: 901 (11/19/07 09:50 PM) |
Doc... I understand your point. But, as mentioned before, the tire exception was/is for "old classics". Any "knowledgable" racer knows that those old classics are obsolete by todays modlite rules. The greatest driver in a 1998 Pro sedan would never be competitive againts a 2007 Pro modlite! You used to have a classic, and I believe you went with a modlite to be competitive. Your fear of a new class of cars forming is unfounded. How many folks do you know are going to sell their modlites to find a pre-1998 classic, just to race for the open tire rule? I know of none. Yes, I know I'm the only one this season to take advantage of the rule. But... others have been watching with interest that have pre-1998 cars sitting in Faulkner County..... you might see a #25 and a #28 next season that haven't seen dirt since 2001! I also wouldn't be suprised to see Rambo's #67 classic return to fame with American Racers or wing next season, along with the #6 Benny Baker(Little Rock) yellow truck that raced with us once last season, and maybe Harris's #33 which is the 3rd classic that runs with us(if he still has it next season). These cars have a 63 inch seat back, in-frame rear suspension, 1X2 tubing from bumper to bumper, and I know one of them has ball joints and chevette spindles just like mine. To stress your point by stating the #00 showing up as a classic is immature. It has none of the post '98 attributes of a dwarfcar that I've mentioned. I know that many older cars have gone to the "pro style" front end. So.... let's say an "old classic" must have 3 of these 4 pre '98 attributes...
1. In-frame rear suspension(including shocks and trailing arms) 2. 63 in seat back('99 and newer cars have 68 inch seat back) 3. 1X2 square tubing bumper2bumper per origional dwarf rules 4. ball-joint front suspension(usually with pinto or chevette spindled cars) Classic bodies of course is required! So there..... 3 items an old classic must have other than a classic body. These cars are readily available nation wide, and all they'll need is a fresh engine and tires to be competitive with today's modlites. As for how or why this tire rule was implemented..... This was something I mentioned back in 2004! Jeremy, Jeff, and I brought it up at a rules meeting in 2005 for the 2006 season. I was at the race in Centerville watching these great drivers(mostly from Iowa) getting their asses handed to them by mostly mediocre modlite drivers. My father bought this classic that I got the 2002 rookie of the year with(won 1 feature and a handful of heats), near the time this tire rule exception was implemented. The wing thing was Jeff's idea, while the tire thing was mine. The #6 was still the 8ball classic driven by ???? Anyway.... that's how the tire rule came about. I planned on racing in 2005, but slow progress on the old chassis Dad bought kept me from racing. I got the #39 modlite because of my impatients, and wanted to experiment before the completion of my classic. That modlite(pre '98 ) that I drove was my brother's in 2002 and was ADCRA points champion(we were all classics then). The mod body was an improvement, but was never a contender againts the new modlites. So Doc... don't think I wasn't around. I was around the ADCRA before you knew what a dwarf car was. |
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SS39 |
Protest Rule! | ||
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Posts: 901 (11/19/07 11:33 PM) |
I believe it's time to implement a protest rule. Something similar to what the mini-sprints do. Since teching is a most thankless job as being a race coordinator, let's do what the 600's do for protest.
Any driver may protest againts the "night's winning car" for $125.oo cash. Things to be checked.... 220#s at ten pumps, ZX12's for stock bore and cams, 1240# spec engined cars for stock bore and cams, etc...etc... $100.oo goes to the person in the right, meaning if car protested againts is illegal, then the protester gets $100.oo returned. If car is legal, then the "legal driver" gets the $100.oo for the trouble. $15.00 should go to the person checking for legality, because it's a job, and he should be paid. $10.oo goes to the club or owner of the bore gauge and compression tool. If car is found illegal, it will forfeit it's winning for last place purse and last place points. If car owner refuses the protest check, then he automatically forfeits the winning purse for last place money and points, and the person protesting gets his $125.oo protest money returned. I think this would be fair. Anyone with a legal engine would love to be protested againts, because it pays an extra $100.00 for the night. 
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Docracer3 |
Thanks... | ||
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Posts: 1037 (11/20/07 01:29 AM) |
Steve,
I appreciate your understanding on the point I was trying to make. I stand by my opinion and what you might think is an immature statement may prove to be a reality. My car was a classic that was converted to a Modlite long before I got it. I only bought this car to get back on the track a couple years ago and to accumulate some new parts a little at a time in order to move them over to a Rhyno Modlite again, which is what I had to start with. So, my car is still a Classic under all of the sheet metal. Nothing fancy about it...well maybe a few things. There is NOTHING about the current rules that delineates an OLD from NEW Classic. And until it does, and we'll have to see how the rules meeting goes, anyone could build a new "Classic" with all new tech under it, and take full advantage of the special concessions to the hilt with a BIG BUILT motor and when that car hooks up with the downforce of the wing and those wide old soft tires....what a mess! I say we need to stick and get back to TUSA Rules...but that is my opinion. Too many concessions is too many concessions. We need to be streamlined and all on the same page...like other classes. It was a fun trial, but I will have to say I'm sticking to my guns on this one. Nothing personal to anyone. |
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